12 :) Sophie Phillipsdatter Cramer and Andreas Mikkelsen Gram (c1691-1748) apparently had 7 children.
In addition to the three you mentioned, I have noted Bergitte Marie b. 1736. Of the children
from the second marriage, I have noted Sophie (Cramer) 1738, Hilchen 1743 and Elisabeth 1744.
https://www.digitalarkivet.no/
https://forum.arkivverket.no/forum/24-arkiv/
https://www.google.com/search?q=translate+norwegian+to+english
Var Marte Bjørnsdotter ei dotter av Bjørn Yggeset i Asker?
I samband med bygdeboka for Høland hev eg komi borti ein familie i Asker. Dei det gjeld er Bjørn Yggeset og kona Berte Andersdotter. Desse er, så vidt eg kan sjå, ikkje omtalt i Torgersens gards- og ættesoge for Asker frå 1941.
Eit søk på Familysearch syner at dei sønene Anders og Steffen fødd høvesvis, 1733 og 1735. Bjørn Yggeset hadde òg eit barn til dåpen 9. november 1726, men namnet er ikkje nemnt.
Eg trur at den Marte Bjørnsdotter, trulova 20. oktober 1754, gift 8. november same år med Kristian Hansen Gram, òg var ei dotter av Bjørn Yggeset.
Her er huslyden. Kristian og Marte var plassbrukarar under Yggeset i 1755 og seinare på Jemtland i Røyken. Men i 1760 var dei komne åt Høland, der dottera Berte Maria vart døypt i 1760. Kristian var frå Høland og son av Hans Abrahamsen Schotte og Anne Maria Kristiansdotter Gram (sjå side 52 i Gards- og slektshistorie for Høland og Setskog Bind 6.2).
Er det nokon som veit noko meir om opphavet åt Marte Bjørnsdotter?
Kristian Hansen Gram, f. 1727, d. Måsaby 1804, gift 1754 i Asker kirke med Marte Bjørnsdatter, f. ca. 1735, d. Taraldslia 1807.
Barn:
1. Anne Maria Kristiansdatter, f. Yggeseteie [Asker] 1755
2. Hans Kristiansen, f. Jemtland [Røyken] 1757.
3. Berte Maria Kristiansdatter, f. 1760
4. Kari Kristiansdatter, f. Hauger 1762, d. Taraldslia 1763.
5. Børre Kristiansen, f. Taraldslia 1764.
6. Kristoffer Kristiansen, f. Taraldslia 1767, d. 1767.
7. Anders Kristiansen, f. Taraldslia 1768.
8. Kristoffer Kristiansen, f. Tyrihjellen 1771.
9. Kristian Kristiansen, f. Bergerud 1776, d. Bergerud 1777.
10. Anne Kristiansdatter, f. Bergerud 1779.
Hun er oppgitt å være 66 år i 1801-tellinga og 86 år ved begravelsen. Det siste må være feil da hun ikke kan ha vært 58 år ved siste barnefødsel.
Edited December 3, 2014 by Frode Myrheim
======
Does anyone know anything more about the origin of Marte Bjørnsdotter?
Kristian Hansen Gram, b. 1727, d. Måsaby 1804, married 1754 in Asker church to Marte Bjørnsdatter, b. Ca. 1735, d. Taraldslia 1807.
Children:
1. Anne Maria Kristiansdatter, b. Yggeseteie [Asker] 1755
2. Hans Kristiansen, b. Jemtland [Røyken] 1757.
3. Berte Maria Kristiansdatter, born 1760
4. Kari Kristiansdatter, b. Hauger 1762, d. Taraldslia 1763.
5. Børre Kristiansen, b. Taraldslia 1764.
6. Kristoffer Kristiansen, born Taraldslia 1767, died 1767.
7. Anders Kristiansen, born Taraldslia 1768.
8. Kristoffer Kristiansen, b. Tyrihjellen 1771.
9. Kristian Kristiansen, b. Bergerud 1776, d. Bergerud 1777.
10. Anne Kristiansdatter, born Bergerud 1779.
She is stated to be 66 years old in the 1801 census and 86 years old at the funeral. The latter must be wrong as she may not have been 58 years old at the last childbirth.
Edited December 3, 2014 by Frode Myrheim
Lars (Madsen) Gram? (ONLINE DISCUSSION)
https://forum.arkivverket.no/topic/233390-skifte-etter-berte-nilsdatter-gram-p%C3%A5-grefsen-i-nes-hedemarken-1689-1692-hvor-finnes-det/?tab=comments#comment-1991094
Ole Arild Vesthagen
Ole Arild VesthagenActive user
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387
Location: Oslo
Posted April 28, 2019
In Norsk slektshistorisk tidsskrift, volume VII, issue 2, pages 183-184 in 1939,
Harald Gram wrote the following in response to a previous question in the journal:
Among other things, a. after Lieutenant Colonel Peter Brun's first wife, who became the ancestor
of most of the large military family Brun.
Wasn't she the daughter of bailiff in Gudbrandsdalen Lars (Madsen) Gram?
Their granddaughter Throne Sophie Brun received 23/2 1697 royal permission to marry Lieutenant
Peter Madsen Gram, despite the fact that they were related in the 3rd paragraph.
At the change after Berthe Nielsdtr. Gram at Grefsheim 1689-92 appeared as deceased relatives
Lieutenant Colonel Ole Brun, chaplain Johan Lobes and merchant Erik Bølling. This relationship
can apparently only be explained by the fact that Lieutenant Colonel Peter Brun's first wife was
the daughter of Lars Gram. one of the sons in this marriage was also named Lars (named after his
grandfather). Another son also owns land in Gudbrandsdalen.
I have tried in vain to find the mentioned shift after Berte Nilsdatter Gram.
The probate records for Hedemarken were not preserved between 1673 and 1693, and the land registers
were not preserved between 1687 and 1694. It is obvious that Harald Gram had found this information
in a specific source. But where? Does anyone have any tips on what source this is from?
====
Leif B. Mathiesen
Leif B. MathiesenActive user
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Location: Fjerdingby
Posted April 28, 2019
Maybe you'll find something here.
09.01.1712 there is a change after Lieutenant Peder Gram on southern Torshaug farm in Gjerdrum
in Akershus
His wife was Trone Sophie Brun.
Change card.
Akershus, Hedmark county, Upper Romerike, Probate card (1683-1865), Probate protocol page, Page 12843
Usage link for page view: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/sk11216061412843
Shift 396a
Akershus, Hedmark county, Upper Romerike, Probate protocol no. 2 (1704-1715), Probate protocol page,
Page 395b-396a
Usage link for page view: https://www.digitalarkivet.no/sk20090130330403
====
Ole Arild Vesthagen
Ole Arild VesthagenActive user
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Author
Posted April 28, 2019
Thanks for the tips. I know the change after Peder Gram. He was the son of
Berte Gram's cousin. I also know the mention in Nes village book. By the way, there are
some mistakes in the village book. Bl. a. she is called Bente, but her name is Berte.
The shift after her is also mentioned in the village book.
It's the original source of the shift after Berte Gram that I'm looking for.
Since Harald Gram in 1939 stated the names of those who were present at the shift,
he must have seen the original document. It is frustrating with genealogical literature
that has no source references.
====
Ole Arild Vesthagen
Ole Arild VesthagenActive user
Users
387
Location: Oslo
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Posted April 28, 2019
There are a number of errors about this family in the village book for Nes.
It says that Nils Eriksen was married to Karen Nilsdtr. Gram, daughter of the
bailiff Lars Gram. It must of course be Karen Larsdtr. Gram. Then it says that
their daughter was named Bente. It must be Berte. Furthermore, it says about his
son Lars that he was a parish priest in Eidsvoll and was married to Margrethe.
That's just nonsense. It was his cousin Lars Jensen Gram who was parish priest
in Eidsvoll and was married to Margrethe. Then it says that the daughters of
Mads Gram, Ingeborg and Johanne, sold Berg in Vang in 1695. Her name was Inger,
not Ingeborg. And the year should be 1698. The last mistake I found out after
reading four volumes of the land registers.
=====
Cecilie Simon
Cecilie SimonActive user
Users
492
Posted August 24, 2019
On 4/28/2019 at 4:33 AM, Ole Arild Vesthagen said:
Their granddaughter Throne Sophie Brun received 23/2 1697 royal permission to marry Lieutenant
Peter Madsen Gram, despite the fact that they were related in the 3rd paragraph.
At the change after Berthe Nielsdtr. Gram at Grefsheim 1689-92 appeared as deceased relatives
Lieutenant Colonel Ole Brun, chaplain Johan Lobes and merchant Erik Bølling. This relationship
can apparently only be explained by the fact that Lieutenant Colonel Peter Brun's first wife was
the daughter of Lars Gram.
Hi!
Did you find this shift?
If so, I hope you post a link here.
And is it true that the relationship can only be explained by the fact that Lieutenant Colonel
Peter Brun's first wife was the daughter of Lars Gram, ie that the deceased Berthe Nielsdatter
Gram and Ole Petersen gram were cousins?
At a time when the husband represented his wife, I mean to have observed that it is also called
kinship now the actual kinship is through the wife? Or is this wrong?
Could there be a possibility that it is Ole Brun's wife Maren Pedersdatter Lund who is the
granddaughter of Laurids Gram? Both Maren and Ole have a brother named Laurids.
When Throne Sophie Olsdatter Brun and Peter Madsen Gram received a royal grant because
they were related in the 3rd paragraph, it means that they each had their grandparents
who were siblings.
Trone Sophie's grandparents were Peter Brun and NN and Peder Nielsen Lund and NN. The
latter couple were very wealthy, lived in Halden and owned, among other things, estates in
Gudbrandsdalen. Here is his estate in 1635, and I wonder if anyone knows if any of this
estate belonged to Laurids Gram or his children? https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/76503/34
It would have been incredibly useful if the shift after Berthe Nielsdatter Gram was found,
so that one could check if there was anything more that could confirm the relationship.
====
Berit Knudsen
Berit KnudsenActive user
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6.3k
Location: Oslo
Posted August 24, 2019
Bastian Svendsen, do not know if he is completely trustworthy?
Eidsvoll, Laurits Gram, Lobes is mentioned here https://www.digitalarkivet.no/pr20130129008688
====
Posted 24 августа 2019, г. (edited)
Could it be Erik Bølling who was a merchant at Bragernes?
Married to Maren Christensdatter fca.1640, daughter of Christen Michelsen Thune and Maren Larsdt.
Gram (1610 Fron - 9/11 1644)?
Johan Jochumsen Lobes ca. 1664 - 1719, res. chap. Eidsvoll - later parish pr. Holtålen from 1696-?
Married 21/6 1690 Eidsvoll with
Magnille Lauritsdt. Gram, dt. by Laurits Madsen Gram and Margrethe Evensdt.
Source: Nermo
Edited August 24, 2019 by Berit Knudsen
====
Jeg har ikke funnet noe mer om skiftet etter Berte Nilsdatter Gram på Grefsheim.
Jeg har nå lagt ut mine slektsnotater om slekten Gram tilgjengelig på min nettside. Se min “aneliste” her: http://www.oavesthagen.no/Mine_aner.htm . Følg linken under de følgende navnene på listen:
3490 Mads Nielsen Gram – kapellan i Land
6980 Niels Larsen Gram – sogneprest i Land
13960 Lars Madsen Gram – fogd i Gudbrandsdalen
27920 Mads Nielsen Gram – sogneprest i Fron
Løytnant Peder Madsen Gram og hans kone Throne Sophia Brun finnes på side 35 i notat 3490. Throne Sophias foreldre finnes i notat 13960 på side 59.
Karen Larsdtr. Gram gift med fogd Niels Erichsen på Hedemarken finnes i notat 13960 på side 45. Datteren Berit Nielsdtr. Gram som bodde på Grefsheim finnes på samme side.
Magnille Larsdtr. Gram som var gift med Johan Lobes finnes i notat 13960 side 26.
Jeg har lagt stor vekt på å finne fram til primærkilder og sitere fra disse. Alle kilder er angitt med fotnoter hvor de finnes.
Ole Arild VesthagenActive user Users 387 Location: Oslo Author Posted August 24, 2019 I have not found anything more about the shift after Berte Nilsdatter Gram at Grefsheim. I have now posted my genealogy notes about the Gram family available on my website. See my "analysis list" here: http://www.oavesthagen.no/Mine_aner.htm. Follow the link under the following names in the list: 3490 Mads Nielsen Gram - chaplain in Land 6980 Niels Larsen Gram - parish priest in Land 13960 Lars Madsen Gram - bailiff in Gudbrandsdalen 27920 Mads Nielsen Gram - parish priest in Fron Lieutenant Peder Madsen Gram and his wife Throne Sophia Brun can be found on page 35 in note 3490. Throne Sophia's parents can be found in note 13960 on page 59. Karen Larsdtr. Gram married to bailiff Niels Erichsen at Hedemarken can be found in note 13960 on page 45. The daughter Berit Nielsdtr. Gram who lived at Grefsheim can be found on the same page. Magnille Larsdtr. Gram who was married to Johan Lobes can be found in note 13960 page 26. I have placed great emphasis on finding primary sources and quoting from them. All sources are indicated with footnotes where they are located.====
Posted August 24, 2019 On 8/24/2019 at 1:20 PM, Berit Knudsen said: Could it be Erik Bølling who was a merchant at Bragernes? Married to Maren Christensdatter fca.1640, daughter of Christen Michelsen Thune and Maren Larsdt. Gram (1610 Fron - 9/11 1644)? Johan Jochumsen Lobes ca. 1664 - 1719, res. chap. Eidsvoll - later parish pr. Holtålen from 1696-? Married 21/6 1690 Eidsvoll with Magnille Lauritsdt. Gram, dt. by Laurits Madsen Gram and Margrethe Evensdt. If this is correct, it is obvious to imagine the possibility that Ole Brun was there as a relative on behalf of his wife Maren Pedersdatter Lund, and that it was thus her unknown mother who was a Gram. ====Posted August 24, 2019 Maren Christensdtr. Gram and her husband Erich Bølling at Bragernes I have in note 13960 on page 75.====
Posted 24 августа 2019, г. (edited) On 8/24/2019 at 11:23 AM, Cecilie Simon said: Here is his estate in 1635, and I wonder if anyone knows if any of this estate belonged to Laurids Gram or his children? https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/76503/34 I do not see that there is any correspondence between the estate of Peder Lund in 1635 and the estate of Lars Madsen Gram in 1624 (see my note 13690 page 4). (Changed a typo - must be 1624) Edited August 24, 2019 by Ole Arild Vesthagen====
Ole, your website is super! I have not seen this connection before, but it was Peder Nielsen Lund who took over as bailiff over Rosenkrantz's estate after Laurids Madsen Gram. It can not be a coincidence then? Both Skoden, which you say Lars Gram lived on in 1608, and Steig in Fron, which you say he moved to in 1612, are among Peder Nielsen Lund's estates in 1635. It must be his wife who is a Gram?====
Posted August 24, 2019 Good observation! I have not thought about this connection. This shows that there was a connection between Lars Madsen Gram and Peder Nielsen Lund. And thus a possibility that Lars' daughter was married to Peder Nielsen Lund and not to Peter Brun. I must have been a little too "hung up" in the layout of Harald Gram in the Norwegian Family History Journal in 1939. The three relatives mentioned in the shift after Berte Nielsdtr. Gram at Grefsen were Ole Brun, Johan Lobes and Erik Bølling. The latter two were undoubtedly married to relatives of Berte and not her own "carnal" relatives. And then it is quite possible that Ole Brun was also married to a relative. I have to "dig" more into this. ====Posted 24 августа 2019, г. (edited) Former councilor in Christiania Hans Madsen Fagerholt is called Peder Nielsen Lund's brother-in-law in a trial around 1660. Hans Madsen and his stepchildren had a number of estates. Do you know anything about him or do you know if any of this is Gram goods? https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/76362/226?indexing=====
Ole Arild VesthagenActive user Users 387 Location: Oslo Author Posted August 24, 2019 Here is Lars Madsen Gram's estate in the Odelsjordeboken in 1624, sorted alphabetically. There does not appear to be any coincidence with the estate of Hans Madsen Fagerholt. Ahnshuus vdj Ringeboe Alme paa Fron Berrigh paa Brottom vdj RingsAgger Biørnstad in Øer Bottim vdj Lesøe Enge paa Thretten Faugne in Gudsdal Fochstad Øffre in the heathland Harildstad paa Quichne Hoele vdj Gudzdal Hofft vdj Lumbs holsbrek on Lesøe Iffuerlj I Gudsdal Ildstad vdj Musedal Joensgrd on Lesøe Kinne paa Brottom vdj RingsAgger Kleffstad in Frons Koldstad paa Fron Kollstad vdj Lesøe Puffins in Ringsagger Løsnes Øffre in Ringeboe Between and Ringebo Mellum vdj Ringeboe Nedre Daller in Waage Nedre Skurdal Nordrum I Ringebo Quigstad paa Fron Rangkleff Øffre in Ringebo Reffsholm paa Fron Rudj paa Fron Silligh on Lesøe Scans on Lum Skurdall paa Fron Slemsrud I Wang paa Hedemarcken Sørumgaard on Lesøe Trygstad in WllensAgger Wettestad in Stange Wisted paa Waage Wldberrig paa Fron Wlleteig on Lesøe====
Posted August 24, 2019 Of Lars Madsen's Grams estate in 1624, Peder Nielsen Lund had at least (I think, because I am incredibly bad at interpreting!) Lunde in Ringsaker and Ahnshuus vdj Ringeboe. In addition, he sits as previously mentioned on Skoden which you say Lars Gram lived on in 1608 and Steig in Fron which you say he moved to in 1612. Cecilie====
Posted August 24, 2019 Lars Madsen Gram owned 9 hides in Anshus in Ringebu and 1 pound and 3 calf skins in Lunde in Ringsaker in 1624. Peder Nielsen owned 1/2 skin in Anshus (= 10 skins) and 1 ship pound of barley flour and 1 skin in Lunde in Ringsaker in 1635. This is a good coincidence. Lars died in 1629 or 1630, so it is quite possible that this was the inheritance of a daughter. Where does it appear that Maren Lund who was married to Ole Petersen Brun was a daughter of Peder Nielsen Lund? It is stated in the shift after Colonel Ole Brun 1.3.1712 that he was married to Maren Lund. But I have not seen any father's name for her. ====I tingboken for Halden er det flere saker ifm Peder Nielsen Lunds begravelse og arv etter hans datter Abigal g. Niels Christophersen Friis som klargjør hans arvinger. I tillegg er det en sak i 1698 etter hans sønn Erik Pedersen.
https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/40?indexing=
Så flere sider, med noen andre ting innimellom https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/56?indexing= og https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/65?indexing= (se særlig forl 62b)
Dommen avsies her https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/74?indexing=
En noe makaber sak om Peder Nielsen Lund sin begravelse https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/11?indexing=
Og rettssak etter Erik Pedersen https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/30995/113 og https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/30995/123
Peder Nielsen Lund og NN Grams? barn var: (er ikke helt ferdig, men jeg mener jeg har alle barna som vokste opp).
1. Berthe Pedersdatter, død i Halden før 1671. Gift med rådmann Søren Jensen Klyne, f. før 1610 i Ribe, død ca 1680 i Halden. Sønn av Jens Andersen Klyne og Anne Jensdatter
2. Sophie Pedersdatter, død før 1665 og gravlagt med foreldrene. Gift med Niels Christensen Hess. Det skiftes visst etter ham, men jag har ikke rukket å sjekke dette enda. Han bodde i Fredrikstad og det er mer informasjon å finne om ham.
3. Abigal Pedersdatter, død ca 1667, gift med Niels Christophersen Friis. Ingen barn.
4. Regina Pedersdatter g. Niels Johansen. Hun lå I Barsel I 1672, men jeg har ikke funnet noe mer om henne eller hennes eventuelle etterkommere
5. Maren Pedersdatter Lund g. trolig 1667 Ole P Brun (Ikke ferdig)
6. Anne Pedersdatter Lund g. Jens P Brun se
—————————–
Posted August 24, 2019 On 8/24/2019 at 4:45 PM, Ole Arild Vesthagen said: Where does it appear that Maren Lund who was married to Ole Petersen Brun was a daughter of Peder Nielsen Lund? In the land register for Halden, there are several cases in connection with Peder Nielsen Lund's funeral and inheritance after his daughter Abigal g. Niels Christophersen Friis which clarifies his heirs. In addition, there is a case in 1698 after his son Erik Pedersen. https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/40?indexing= Then several pages, with some other things in between https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/56?indexing= and https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/65?indexing= (see especially forl 62b) The verdict is handed down here https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/74?indexing= A somewhat macabre case about Peder Nielsen Lund's funeral https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29060/11?indexing= And trial after Erik Pedersen https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/30995/113 and https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/30995/123 Peder Nielsen Lund and NN Grams? children were: (not quite done, but I mean I have all the children who grew up). 1. Berthe Pedersdatter, died in Halden before 1671. Married to councilor Søren Jensen Klyne, born before 1610 in Ribe, died about 1680 in Halden. Son of Jens Andersen Klyne and Anne Jensdatter Daughter g. Gunder Olsen, both lived in 1698 Cathrine Sørensdatter g. Andreas / Anders P Brun (brother of Ole and Jens Brun below) 2. Sophie Pedersdatter, died before 1665 and buried with her parents. Married to Niels Christensen Hess. It seems to be changing after him, but I have not had time to check this yet. He lived in Fredrikstad and there is more information to be found about him. Johannes / Johan Nielsen Hess, skipper abroad in 1698, married to Cathrine There is supposed to be another child, but I have not come that far yet 3. Abigal Pedersdatter, died about 1667, married to Niels Christophersen Friis. No children. 4. Regina Pedersdatter Mr. Niels Johansen. She was in childbirth in 1672, but I have not found anything more about her or her possible descendants5. Maren Pedersdatter Lund g. Probably 1667 Ole P Brun (Not finished) Lorentz Brun died 1732, g. Anne Marie Resen (died 18.3.1759 Frozen in Sparbu. Daughter of Christopher Paulsen Resen and Øllegård Stensdatter Lindved) Peder Brun died about 1713 g. Nellone Worm (died about 1713. Daughter of Claus Nicolausen Worm and Anne Nilsdatter Maigård) Throne Sophie Brun, lived 1741 at Egner in Sørum, g. Peder Madsen Gram after royal grant. Related in 3rd Paragraph. (1651-1711. Son of Mats Nielsen Gram and Kirsten Knutsdatter) Johan Brun died 13.4.1708 Anne Marie Brun died 1717 at Totoen. G1. March 1707 Anthony Coucheron (died12.4.1707) g2. Ambrosius Leffelmann (died 8.9.1730) Frans Brun b. Ca 1670, d. 6.3.1733, g. 1711 in Trondheim with Anne Cathrine Frost (died 1768 in Orkdal) Janicke / Anichen Brun b. Ca 1684, d. 1744 Ringsker I Hedemark. Mr. Christian Blickfeldt 6. Anne Pedersdatter Lund g. Jens P Brun se 7. Laurids Pedersen b. Ca 1648 at Stumberg. Still lived 1671 on Stumberg. Mentioned in the land register 1680 in connection with an old mortgage deed on Solberg and southern Kleppe which has burned up in the great fire, and is not mentioned as blessed, but can still be dead 8. Erik Pedersen, I think he is younger than Laurids but am unsure of this. Watches. Died 1697 at Vevlen in Halden. Married 1684 to Brithe Eriksdatter, who still lived as a widow in 1698. No children. 9. Debora Pedersdatter. Unmarried in 1667. Died 1704 in Skien. Married to Abraham Petersen Melbø, died in Skien 1699, it changes. No children====
Since my interpretive qualities are not top notch, I have linked to printed sources that have "interpreted" what stands for me where possible. Here is a summary of the information I have so far found about Peder Nilsen Lund at Stomberg on Idd (Halden). Post it here, in case more people can contribute to a solution to this, or have found other relevant sources. Peder Nielsen Lund b. Ca 1588 in Baahus? (76 years in 1664) - d. 1666 at Stumberg in Idd, Halden. Change 7.-9. Aug 1666 (mentioned in a lawsuit in connection with the death of his son Erik, https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/44137/240 and https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/44137/348). 1. I believe that it is probable that Peder Nielsen was married to a Lauridsdatter Gram, and that it is thus not Peter Brun who was married to a daughter of LG as previously assumed. If I have understood it correctly, the reason for the assumption is that Peter Brun was married to a daughter of LG, changed after Berthe Nielsdtr. Gram at Grefsheim 1689-92. The original of the shift is not known. Lieutenant Colonel Ole Brun, chaplain Johan Lobes and merchant Erik Bølling performed as deceased relatives. This relationship can apparently only be explained by the fact that Lieutenant Colonel Peter Brun's first wife was the daughter of Lars Gram. If this is the main argument that Peter Brun was married to a Gram, I believe that the statement "apparently only explained by the fact that Lieutenant Colonel Peter Brun's first wife was the daughter of Lars Gram" is incorrect. Lieutenant Colonel Ole Brun, chaplain Johan Lobes and merchant Erik Bølling are all called relatives in the shift, but we know that the last 2 were relatives through his wife. Thus, it is likely that this also applies to Ole Brun. In any case, it does not show that Ole Brun's mother was a Gram and that this is the only explanation. 2. Throne Sophie Olsdatter Brun and Peter Madsen Gram received royal permission for marriage, because they were related in the 3rd paragraph. This means that they each had their grandparents who were siblings. For Trone Sophie we have the grandparents Peter Brun and NN (Could this still be Elisabeth Worm, who we know Peter was married to?) And Peder Nielsen Lund and NN For Peder Gram, we know that the relationship is on the Gram side (it follows from the shift after Berthe Nielsdatter). Then we are left with Nils Larsen Gram and Anne Pedersdatter3. In addition, we know the following about Peder Nielsen Lund: Took over about 1630 as bailiff for the Rosenkranske estate Søndafjelds after Lars gram who died at this time Set in 1635 with estates that had previously been Lars Gram's estates to which LG was associated. (See Ole Arild's website # 9) Skoden in Fron, where LG lived in 1608. Who owned this in 1624? Steig i Fron which LG moved to in 1612. Who owned this in 1624? Anshus in Ringebu (LG 1624) Lunde i Ringsaker (LG 1624) 4. Had children named Laurids and Berthe (which I do not emphasize much, because these names are very common). Peder Nielsen Lund's children appear from # 19 Here is what I have so far found about Peder Nielsen Lund in the sources. I have found him for the first time in 1631. Then he had taken over after Laurids Gram as bailiff for the Rosenkranske estate Søndafjelds, but had probably taken over already the year before. The case takes place in Bergen in August 1631, but it is said that he was not summoned in 1630 as he should have been. https://www.nb.no/items/066ed37ad6f2b6658c3228d003b38ba9?page=257&searchText=peder The first time I have found an overview of Peder's estate is in 1635. At that time he probably lived on Tasken in Råde, at least it says the year after he applied for Tasken. 1635 https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/76503/34. Interpreted here1636 https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/76503/125Peder must have been very rich. When the king in the late 1630s asked for extra money to secure the border with Germany, Peder gave 10 rd, more than 3 times as much as the bailiff. https://www.nb.no/items/6062472a5755cc6c95b8461c110b74db?page=181&searchText=stumberg In 1640 Vold called his estate. "Used by the nobleman Peder Nielson ok in the nobility tax Introduced" https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/76504/172 Vold was the only estate he owned in Idd in 1635. In Matrikkelen in 1647 he is also listed with Vold. I have not been able to find who put on Violence in 1624. I have a suspicion that a look in the archives in Sweden might have given some answers? · Land registers before 1624 and for the settlement of garrison tax 1624-1626 [The land registers for Båhus county were transferred to SRA in 1900] · Odelsjordebøker for some vikværske len 1624-1626 [Båhus county transferred to SRA in 1900] Eventually Peder got rid of goods in Råde and Gudbrandsdalen and bought up in Idd. He took over this estate after the sisters Anne Cathrine and Margrethe Nettelhorst. The estate in Båhuslen he put on throughout the spring period. That in Baahus, was mostly "frælesgods". In 1574-75 I have noted that this estate in Skee free estate, but there I forgot to note the source 1646 suppl that he must be allowed to sell a ship part of the ship he had a few years ago had built for a hamburger https://www.nb.no/items/f86669a483ab234604f1440e0daf2032?page=359&searchText=nielszen 1648 Suppl about the cargo of Peder's ship Raphael, which during the sweeping period had brought cargo from Drammen to Copenhagen. https://www.nb.no/items/c1571323902be67cc2b92b1e5eb3e4c5?page=61&searchText="peder nielszen "1650s, Gods i Baahus https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055667_00234#?c=&m=&s=&cv=233&xywh=1024%2C1031%2C2790%2C1593 1655 Peder Olsen Nordmann, his father-in-law Niels Hansen Mengd and Peder Nielsen at Stumberg, a loan? https://www.nb.no/items/134c58badcdc055cc7f613e441f53c3a?page=127&searchText=stumberig 1658 (1674), a case after Pedersen's death where Jens Brun and his wife Anne Pedersdatter sell Tellingsås in Engedal to Fabian Stang and his wife Karen Knudsdatter. Ole Nielsen and Søren Jensen Klyne are called his brothers-in-law. Why is Ole Nilsen called his brother-in-law, his daughter was married to Søren Jensen Klyne? Jens Brun's saddle weather father Peder Nielsen Stomberg of saddle Peder Bagge to helmegård and his dear wife Mrs. Margreth Nettelhorst for borrowed money dated 26.8.1658. https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/65978/121 His estate in 1659 https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/76509/46 In the Swedish land register 1659, his estate in Baahus does not correspond with what is in the Norwegian land register .: https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055668_00448#?c=&m=&s=&cv=447&xywh=2336%2C2104% 2C3044% 2C1738Norwegian land register 1659 Swedish land register 1659 Buer Is that Bu? Bonden (Peder) bøksler + Skee kirke https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055668_00459#?c=&m=&s=&cv=458&xywh=619%2C2366%2C2721%2C1553 Bø “A fougde in Aggersshuus lähn, on Stomberg Hr? Peder Nielsen saves Godz https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055668_00467#?c=&m=&s=&cv=466&xywh=707%2C1823%2C2721%2C1553 Knarvigen The king, but see under Bø, is also mentioned there https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055668_00452#?c=&m=&s=&cv=451&xywh=790%2C963%2C3043%2C1738 Tange See under Bø, it is mentioned Flaadenes Is this under Tiärnøen? Aaserud It says that the king and skee vicarage own. See under bø, there is also mention https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055668_00450#?c=&m=&s=&cv=449&xywh=2263%2C644%2C3044%2C1738 Tiärnøen is it Floängian? on Tiärnø ”Peder Stomberg” or is this Flaadnes over https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055668_00471#?c=&m=&s=&cv=470&xywh=997%2C2554%2C1762%2C1006 On Tiernø, according to the Swedish land register, he also sits on Kozsnäs, who is the savior Godz https://sok.riksarkivet.se/bildvisning/A0055668_00471#?c=&m=&s=&cv=470&xywh=3236%2C1738%2C1762%2C10061661 gives Peder Stumberg a small place with a house by Stumberg mills https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/65978/92?indexing= 1661 In a case from 1661, Christiania's former councilor Hans Madsen (Fagerholt) is called Peder's brother-in-law. https://www.nb.no/items/532c08d8a9f08e61a7613ece3bd131ca?page=219&searchText="hans madssen "" raadmand i christiania "og https://www.nb.no/items/8b0d2002056a58f85b4b2 In 1664 it is stated that he is 76 years old and lived at Stumberg. The son Laurids, 16 years old is also mentioned. 1664 supl that he must get compensation for what he had to dedicate to the military in the previous feud period https://www.nb.no/items/1222434c5e0da39ec07669d33ffbe7c9?page=17&searchText=nielszen 1682 a case of theft and Sara Larsdatter who escaped and did not dare to return before Peder Nielsen Stumberg was dead https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29108/71 1683, a case about borders including northern Vold's borders, which also mentions Hall Niels Stumberg (Peder's son?) Without me getting any connection. https://media.digitalarkivet.no/view/29109/44. In addition, there is the somewhat macabre case of his funeral and inheritance after his daughter Abigal Pedersdatter. Edited August 30, 2019 by Cecilie Simon ====Posted August 30, 2019 Here is Peder Nielsen's estate in the list for land tax in 1635 for Idd and Marker len. Peder Nielsen's Jordeguotz wdj Thasken Butter ________________________________ vj phd wdj Raae Østergaardtt huder__________________________ j wdj Sønder Wold paa Idtt Malt______________________ j Skipphd In Nordder Wold ibm. Malt__________________________ j Skipphd wdj Thange i Skee Sogen vdj Baahus Lheen, Malt________ ij Skpphd wdj Buer ibm. Malt_______________________________ iij Skpphd Bøe Sammestedtz Malt_______________________________ ij Skpphd foring______________________________ xj s. wdj Knaruig Sammestedtz Malt______________________ j Skipphd fuoring____________________ 6 s wdj Fladeng Sammestedtz Malt______________________ j celebration, wdj Maageløs Ødegaardtt wdj Gulbrantzdalen Huder____ j wdj Hoffde ibm Huder_______________________________ j wdj Opsall i Ringeboe huder__________________________ j wdj Anshus huder ________________________________ j wdj Skaboe wdj frone sogen huder___________________ j wdj Skoddinggaarder huder___________________________ ij wdj Support Ødegaard ibm huder_______________________ j wdj Stiene Ødegaard ibm huder_______________________ j wdj Katlerød, and Wigen Ødegaard Thørfisk ____________ iiij b. phd. wdj Theyger huder__________________________________ j wdj Nordder Vogestad vdj Vang Sogn huder____________ ij wdj Lille Bierget, vdj Ringsagger Sogen paa heemarken, Rugmiell___________________________________ j phd wdj Lunde Bygmiell_______________________________ j Skipphd Hudder______________________________ j wdj Slensrøed i Vang Sogne huder___________________ ij wdj Thofften Røse Bygmeell___________________________ j Skipphd Der aff Betalt til kong: Maytz: wdj Skat, den fierde paart, Ehr Money__________________________________________ xx rixdlr ij ₻ viiij s.Of this we find Anshus in Ringebu, Berg in Ringsaker, Hovde in Lom, Lunde in Ringsaker and Slemsrud in Vang on Hedemarken among the estates that the bailiff Lars Madsen Gram owned in the noble land register in 1624. Lars Gram lived on Skoden in Fron in 1599 and on Steig in Fron in 1612. Both of these farms were later owned by Peder Nielsen Lund. Lars Gram was bailiff for the Rosenkrantz family's estate in Gudbrandsdalen until he died in 1629 or 1630. In 1630, Peder Nielsen Lund had succeeded him in this position. I therefore support Cecilie Simon's conclusion that the bailiff Lars Madsen Gram had an unnamed daughter who was married to Peder Nielsen Lund and not married to Lieutenant Colonel Peter Brun. Harald Gram's conclusion in the Norwegian Genealogical Journal in 1939 was based solely on the assumption that Ole Petersen Brun was an actual relative of Berthe Nielsdtr. Gram at the shift after her at Grefsen in Nes. But it is quite possible that Ole Petersen Brun, on the other hand, was married to a relative of Berthe, as the other two present at the shift actually were. Then it is more likely that Lars Gram's daughter was his mother-in-law, and not his mother. I'm in the process of correcting my genealogy notes that I referred to in post # 9.